Despite our best efforts to dissuade you, many of you have still decided to write to us with your problems, complaints and crises of the moment. We don't have a trained therapist on staff, and this isn't "Dear F*ckin' Abbey", but we DO have Bonnie, who has graciously volunteered her time and heartless perspectives in order to minister to (or macerate) the misguided, with "Dear Fuckin' Bon..."

August 25, 2002

Dear Bon,

I happened to read Brian Gulledge's 'nice guys' article, together with much of the similar material on your website, and while I agreed with most of its content, a few parts left me somewhat confused. I asked the author about this and he replied, but I'd like to hear your opinion as well on a few things.

I wonder why you felt you wouldn't just be up front about your point of view. Could it be because you are trying to find a way to Argue Something with us and thought you could get an angle? Sad.

Basically, his advice was 'love women... respect them, enjoy their conversations'. HBI says 'women are people, not potential sex-on-a-stick'. This is of course common sense, and in theory, the model by which all civilized humans should behave.

So whether it's common sense or theoretically practical, you choose to respect them and enjoy conversation, right? Oh, but no, of course not....

In practice, however... to consider a girl you like an equal and a friend is great, but chances are you will end up friends and nothing more.

Well, I guess if you want someone more subservient or maybe more game-playing, we won't fault you for that. Maybe you want a more "traditional" girl? We just have higher standards for ourselves, and the men and women who love bitches have higher standards as well. The problem is, if that traditional girl is what you want, it's easier, so why are you writing whinging to *us* in the first place? If you're mad that you aren't someone we'd be interested in, why don't you just work on yourself enough to be more interesting? (particularly for YOURSELF, and not to manipulate anyone else).

You can hold deep, meaningful conversations, be a perfect gentleman, respect her, allow her freedom, and ultimately watch her go out with other guys, knowing that yours will be the shoulder she comes to cry on whenever Mr. Current Boyfriend turned out to be a jerk.

Ah, you're one of those. You "don't get it," (in any sense of the word) so you blame the women rather than wondering either about the dependent clingy people you choose for friends, or you "act" like a friend when you really want more and you resent that you can't have it. It *is* so much easier to look outside of yourself and blame others rather than wonder what it is you are missing. ("allow" her freedom; everyone catch THAT one?)

It's always good to have a good friend, whether male or female, but what if you've started to develop feelings for this person? What if you're interested in more than just having another drinking buddy? If on the other hand you act confident and try to steer in the direction of 'something more', you are of course a sleazebag who just wants to get in her pants. It starts to look like romance and an honest, communicative relationship are mutually exclusive, but surely that can't be right.

It seems to be true in the whiney "it's your fault" kind of nice-guy world. Honest and communicative? If your "friendship" consists mostly of a drinking buddy, that may have something to do with both where it goes --or doesn't-- as well as having some bearing on the quality of person you're hanging out with. (not that partying is bad, but as a lifestyle choice wherein you call a friend "my drinking buddy," that may be an indication of priorities, you know.) As far as "steering in the direction of something more," why the hell can't you just talk to the girl who is supposedly such a close friend?! (These bozos just don't DARE talk to women honestly; and it's so much easier to whine that as "nice guys" them women can't read their minds and won't just fall in love and/or put out all of a sudden. ACK!!)

I'm confused here. It seems like a 'damned if you do, damned if you don't' situation. So I guess in the end my question is: If you've fallen in love with someone, how do you proceed to let her know and hopefully reciprocate (or at least make her feelings clear), without being a wimp, a manipulator, or ending up 'just friends'?

I really have to actually write this out for you, don't I? You TALK to her, let her know how you feel. If you already know that there are reasons she may not be interested (ie: she's focussing on school/job right now, you may not be "her type", she has a boyfriend or is only dating at the moment) but you still want to get it off your chest, then you acknowledge the above factors but say you just want her to know how you feel, knowing that if she is uncomfortable about that it may cause some distance in the friendship. Believe me, if you can't communicate any better than you have been then you both need some distance in the relationship, whatever kind of relationship it really is.

Maybe I'm missing something obvious, I don't know. Hope I wasn't too confusing, and any advice would be appreciated. Thanks :)

You weren't confusing, just illogical and a whiney, woman-blaming self-identified "nice guy" who cannot figure out why one should really speak one's mind rather than expecting that others should either read your mind or do all the work.

Incidentally, you may want to look at your categorizations of girls who are "friends," girls who you are romantically interested in, and of course, "girls like us." (Hint, generalities are usually fatal with any *person* who would like to be considered as an actual individual rather than a type or conquest.)

I'd wish you good luck, but I worry about your "friend" in that context.
bon

--or I may just steer you toward someone who gets it.

DfB

I used to complain about my lack of romance. I'm talking romance, not sex. You know sharing obnoxious moments and enjoying them together. Living the whole hand in hand in some far gone land scenario. Then I became more desperate and complained about the absence of any semblance of physical sexuality in my life (ughh this sounds like a fucking dissertation ). Then I became obsessed with the life will happen tomorrow ideology. I would pathetically imagine some future fling. I began to wonder why lord why am I a twenty one year old virgin? Then it hit me! You have to talk to people! This novel concept for some reason had avoided me. I was too enamoured with the hollywoodisms of the vibe, destiny, true love and instant gratification. I was expecting some girl to notice me by the punch bowl at the school dance. I was expecting people to notice my significance from a mere glance. That's not the way of the world. So I began my vocalizations.

Once I was talking to the "fairer" sex (I kind of hate that term) I began the countdown. First date and I'm on my way to the puntang palace (this juvenile terminology demonstrates my mindset). Then I waited........ and waited. Never attaining my room at the "Puntang Palace". Why was this? Hmmmmmm.... I'm not bad looking I have anything but a weight problem. So I delved into psychiatric literature on human sexuality in a desperate attempt to figure out my problem. Then another revelation occured to me: Women aren't whores. Not that I ever thought they were but that was my mindset. Realizing instant gratification is about as likely as being hit by lightening , unless I had some serious cash to shell out I took on a different mental perspective. Treat relationships with humility and stop falling in love with everyone. Just because a girl says hi doesn't mean she wants to screw your brains out.

I am sick of men and women jabbering about "true love". I've heard this term used to describe almost every boyfriend / girlfriend my relatives have had. I grew tired of terms like , "this is the one" , "we understand each other" , "he's my true love". Only to be replaced with terms like "bitch " and "bastard" . I finally realized that I was just as obnoxious envisioning marriage and stability with people I hardly even knew. It's all about getting to know people and treating them with decency. Though never losing sight of the fact that there are people out there who still cling to some arcane notion of prince/princess charming and that you'll be hurt. You'll be hurt sometimes. Live with it and move on. You're probably not going to win her/him back. Give it up. You'll only end up appearing pathetic if you pursue your "true love". No never means yes. There are over six billion people on this earth. Several billion of whom are adults. Half or so of those are of the opposite sex. Do yo u know how much a billion is? It would take a good portion of your life to count to a billion : given you didn't sleep . Over twenty years. Or in other words there are other fish in the sea(cheesy redundant term alert). Go swimming.

Mr. Romano

Mr. Romano.
We'll remind them again but you can see how difficult it is to get through to them. I think it's that old "getting to know them and treat them with decency" thing. Whatta lotta work, huh? Good going.

Thanks,
bon